Unlocking Cultural Agility with Marco Blankenburgh
Unlocking Cultural Agility with Marco Blankenburgh
The Intersection of Personality and Culture with Corrina Cross
Join Corrina Cross as she explores how understanding empathy, personality, and intercultural wiring helps managers create powerfully productive teams.
Corrina is a People Skills Consultant and Lead Facilitator at The People People. She has been in Dubai for 27 years and in the middle east for many more years. She helps business owners and managers improve teamwork, increase productivity and reduce turnover through learning and development solutions. Her intercultural background inspires and intrigues.
Examine the depth of self-culture with her as she connects it to everything from corporate teams to mothers-in-law.
| You will learn about:
- How empathy, personality, and cultural agility combine to create effective teams.
- How to engage in this new world without borders.
- The role that people skills will play in a future alongside Artificial Intelligence.
Learn more about the work Corrina is doing at http://www.the-people-people.com/
|
Articles--
Two Spotlights for Illuminating Human Behavior (http://kwx.fyi/two-spotlights-for-human-behavior)
Motivating My Team... "The Inter-Cultural Manager" (http://kwx.fyi/motivating-my-team)
-- Brought to you by KnowledgeWorkx.com
i think when we are born in a particular
country and we live there for quite a
number of years
we are like a piece of the jigsaw and we
fit into that jigsaw beautifully and i
think once we leave our original country
and we
the longer we stay away the more our
piece of jigsaw changes so that when we
go back it doesn't fit into that jigsaw
anymore
so i feel as though we should create a
new jigsaw called citizens of the world
and each one of us will have a beautiful
piece of the jigsaw that fits in
perfectly
[Music]
welcome to the cultural agility podcast
where we explore the stories of some of
the most advanced intercultural
practitioners from around the world
to help you become culturally agile and
succeed in today's culturally complex
world i'm your host marco blankenberg
international director of knowledgebooks
where every day we help individuals and
companies achieve relational success in
that same complex world
welcome everybody to this new episode of
our podcast and i'm very excited today
because a friend colleague partner of
ours has agreed to join us so karina
welcome to this podcast
and in this podcast we're talking about
our intercultural lives but also
our professional lives as well as the
rest of our lives because intercultural
is everywhere so thank you karina for
joining us and i'm looking forward to
this conversation and maybe without me
doing much of an introduction if you
could introduce yourself to our audience
today
sure thanks marco and uh thank you for
inviting me on to the show
so my name is karina cross and i've been
in the region for well in dubai for 27
years and in the middle east for
many more years than that
and
i help business owners and managers to
to create basically happy and productive
teams by improving their people skills
so that's in a nutshell
what i do and
you know why i've come across
intercultural intelligence and embraced
it
that's great wow 27 years in the gulf
region
so
how did you arrive into this region
you don't seem to
be one of the gulf nationals
how did you end up in the region
to be honest the first time i came to
the region was at age 13 my father
worked in doha now this is going to show
my age i was living in doha before they
had english-speaking schools so
my sister and brother and i had to do
correspondence course and later we lived
in egypt for five years
so initially i was in the middle east
because of my father and his job
and traveled as a family and then later
i
decided that i
would explore dubai
and came to take a look at it and as a
lot of people stayed for many years
longer right right so it sounds like you
you've been exposed and lived in quite a
few countries around the region
and i see this often with people who
have had an expat life for such a long
time so i'm curious if if you had to
explain who you are as a as a cultural
human being what would you say how would
you introduce yourself well well i've
caught myself recently saying that i'm
english as in i have a british passport
but i don't feel very british and
i've also said that
i think
when we are born in a particular country
and we live there for quite a number of
years
we are like a piece of the jigsaw and we
fit into that jigsaw beautifully and i
think once we leave our original country
and we the longer we stay away the more
our piece of jigsaw changes so that when
we go back it doesn't fit into that
jigsaw anymore and of course living in
the uae we cannot become emiratis so we
don't fit into the uae jigsaw um so i
feel as though we should create a new
jigsaw called citizens of the world and
each one of us will have a beautiful
piece of the jigsaw that fits in
perfectly i love that yeah because you
are very much a global citizen knowing
you for all this many years
and i'm curious intercultural was
already important in your life before
you might have been exposed to
intercultural intelligence before you
know being exposed to the language of
the framework and the assessments and
everything so
how did intercultural from what you
remember how did it become part of your
life and where did it feature from
memory
well i suppose by name as you said by
name i came into contact with it about
2010 that's how long well we've known
each other for longer than that but
that's when i became a practitioner and
it was only doing that
practitioner course that i realized oh
my goodness i have experienced
miscommunication from different cultures
for many many years i have
iranian blood in my family they have
iranian members of the family uh but
they you know
moved to england when they were young
and you know my father's half english
half iranian and growing up i just
thought i was in a british family that
you know were born some of them were
born elsewhere and we were
raised as british people i felt that we
were doing british things and behaving
in a british way and i didn't know any
different uh until i came across
intercultural intelligence and i
realized oh my goodness that there was
so much misunderstanding within the
family
um that from the iranian side there was
a lot of shame and honor
um who treat families differently and
who
have different
importance on different things
from the innocent skilled culture and so
yeah
and and just for our audience you're
alluding to honor shame innocence guilt
which is part of the the three colors of
world view
and and that indicates that that you're
you've incorporated the language of of
the intercultural framework and when you
first got exposed to it you already
mentioned that it's sort of shown a
spotlight on your own
stuff that happened in the family and
what in what other way did ici become
attractive to you
well
i've always been a people person in fact
i realized that at school i used to look
around the kids in the class and think
why is that guy so loud maybe he's
nervous and he's trying to overcome his
nervousness i was always trying to work
out why people were the way they were
and as you know i think it was 2009 i
became a facilitator for personality
types and uh understanding people at a
different level was so
amazing and such an eye-opener that i
think intercultural intelligence was a
natural progression from there
and you've you've been working with the
intercultural intelligence framework for
many years
and i'm just wondering
how does that impact you personally as
you
look at the framework you make it part
of you
intellectually but it seems in your case
it's much deeper than that
um so how does it impact you personally
well
it helps me to understand people and so
i'm constantly thinking not just what
did that person do how did they behave
but
why would they have behaved in that way
i think well i think i absolutely know
it makes me so understanding of people
in fact to this day friends call me when
they're having a
disagreement with somebody they call me
to help me what do they say your voice
of reason but what they mean is you know
help me look at this from a different
angle
that's beautiful
yeah
now one of the things that we advocate
with with our intercultural intelligence
work is this idea that
yes we all might have a nationality we
might have an ethnic background or we
might have a certain racial affiliation
for instance but at the same time we're
saying that every person has their own
unique cultural wiring
you already alluded to
having lived in in multiple countries
having mixed heritage at least from a
nationality point of view in your family
what does that mean to you that every
person
has their own unique cultural wiring how
important is that for you
it's extremely important because
people are so often clumped together and
described as you know british people are
like that
indians are like that germans are like
that whatever um whatever the topic
they're talking about and
years ago
that was not the case and now it's
really not the case because just because
that person has a german passport or
whatever it is
doesn't identify them at all and so it's
so important
that we understand that person and his
or her individual culture
and
it just brings to mind now that
with us you know working remotely
it's
it's even more important or it's more
challenging put it that way it's so
important for us to understand the
individual culture of everybody we're
working with but now it's more difficult
to do that and so people should really
you know look at the way they're wording
their emails or you know how they behave
on zoom chords um to get to know and
understand that individual fully it's
fascinating you mentioned that because
i've heard people say exactly the
opposites like now we're all on zoom
we're not in each other's space anymore
so we need to pay less attention to this
intercultural stuff wow you're saying
the opposite apparently yeah whether
it's personalities or cultures i think
now it's so important that we look for
those little differences because people
need to feel they still need to feel
heard they still need to feel as though
they belong and
so i'm helping clients to
look at how emails are written look how
whatsapp messages are written look how
willing people are to
open the camera open the camera turn the
camera on
be visible not be visible
how they interact in a zoom meeting so
it's really helping them to look at
those micro messages to understand their
their employees better
very important and almost sounds like a
new skill set that we need to learn at a
more fine-tuned level
yeah and and in that sense uh you you
work as a facilitator consultant advisor
tell me a little bit more about what you
do from a professional point of view
well i deliver a range of people skills
and so when a client i often work with
large corporates and in recent times
it's more business owners as well who
are wanting to build stronger teams and
understand their employees better and so
i usually listen to their challenge and
once they tell me where they're facing
the challenges then i can identify is it
because the personalities are clashing
is it because there are so many cultures
and they don't all understand each other
is it about
the communication are they giving
feedback in a way that's respected or
you know received in the right way so i
kind of make a cocktail
to
to really what i call hit the nail on
the head and deliver
the right program or the right training
to to meet their needs
and obviously as you do that
every opportunity to deliver those
services starts with a conversation
and you sort of alluded to it earlier on
but i'm curious how how would you use
your
cultural agility your intercultural
intelligence in in engaging with the
client what's different what what are
you listening for what type of questions
are you asking how does it help you
engage the client well to start with i
have
moodles of empathy
so i think
that also if you add empathy plus
the knowledge of personality types and
the knowledge of intercultural
intelligence it really helps me to stand
in the shoes of the client
and
i actually believe that
people who are
cultural learners like myself because
you know as well as i do there are
people who have lived overseas for many
many years but they still
are not cultural learners they still
believe that their culture is better
than others so for somebody like myself
who's very open i think we
absorb
differences and we adapt and adjust the
way we communicate with people without
even realizing it anymore i think we
become
chameleons but not in a in a fake way
but just
something inside us helps us to relate
to those individuals in a way that
is respectful
in their culture does that make sense oh
totally and i love that combination that
you mentioned empathy
deeper understanding of personality
behavioral styles as well as an
understanding of the intercultural
wiring of the person in front of you i
think that's a that's a huge a powerful
way to to shine light on the
relationship on the issues that the
client is facing so i love that
could you maybe give one example of how
that plays out in which way does ici
make a difference in your work and what
you do with clients
well
one answer that immediately springs to
mind is that there is no
one-size-fits-all
and whether it's a training company that
comes to me asking me to put a course
together or a client coming to me
i think initially they think oh here we
go because i ask so many questions to
really dig deep and understand what are
the challenges that they actually are
facing so that i can deliver the right
program
i've worked a lot with engineers
predominantly from the western world
who
do business with people in the oil and
gas you know clients in the oil and gas
industry that are very much from the
middle east
and
it's so wonderful to see the penny drop
when you when their minds open
and they realize oh my goodness how i've
been communicating with my clients how
i've been behaving with my clients how
i've been tapping my watch and saying
it's time you know for the meeting to
start or the meeting to end
it's so wonderful for those
aha moments and then to realize just how
how differently they could have done
things and what better response they
could have got and one thing i tell all
my clients all my participants when it
comes to personalities or intercultural
intelligence is there is no right or
wrong there is only different and if we
start by opening our minds to there
isn't a right way or a wrong way there's
my way there's your way but you know
they're just different ways of doing
things yeah yeah
it's um it's fascinating to hear you
connect your life story
to how you make that valuable in your
professional life as well
what about but your your
circle i mean we all have been in
various versions of lockdown so
human connect is limited but can you use
ici cultural agility with friends and
family as well you mentioned earlier on
that sometimes people call you to
shed more intercultural light on issues
they're facing but
almost created the impression that that
was like professional advice but does it
happen in any circle of friends
neighborhood whatever do you have an
example of that well actually this is
probably an unusual example and i was
even thinking of not writing a book
about it but i i was shocked to think
that i don't think anybody has looked at
this topic in this way and i'll share
with you that a friend of mine had big
problems with
uh mother-in-law
and you know you hear mother-in-law
jokes all over the world it's you know
every nationality every culture you know
makes fun of mothers-in-law at some
stage and i
as i was helping her to understand the
mother-in-law's point of view and to
look at differences i realized that
actually this is intercultural
intelligence because
it's a cultural issue i don't think
anybody has connected the dots and
thought a mother-in-law issue is
actually a cultural issue because the
mother and the the son have the mother
has raised the son in her family where
these are our traditions this is the way
we do things and the new wife has been
raised by her parents and that's the way
they do things and then you join forces
and all of a sudden there's a clash
because there's it's our way of doing
things even if they're the same
nationality and they've lived in the
same country for years because it's it's
the way
they have been you know even traditions
christmas do you celebrate on 24th or
the 25th do you open all the presents at
the same time or do you open a present
every day for the next week so it's
quite fascinating and i actually helped
those
friends
understand not only
is your mother-in-law challenge actually
a cultural issue but i also help them
understand shame and honor as well
because they had a few different
cultures going on in there so yeah and
the funny thing is the mother-in-law is
also a friend of mine and sometime later
the mother-in-law started telling me
about shame and honor this thing called
shame on honor and
i was the one that explained it in the
first place so yeah
it crops up in unusual places marco but
it's always useful it's fascinating i
love it
yeah it's um it's true when you think
about either two homes coming together
with mother-in-law proverbially
typically in the middle
but also when you have generations
coming together we've had people talking
you know about generational differences
and how helpful it is to even use
the framework that we have to explain
some of those differences it creates a
different conversation around old and
young
and finding that that happens across the
world actually yeah now you've been in
the ici space now for
10 years plus right that's 2009 yeah
it's it's that long already
so as you know we we have both ici
trainings
cultural agility development that you
also provide yourself as a practitioner
but we also have certifications for
people who really want to get into it
either as a trainer or as a coach or as
a
facilitator
somebody listening to this conversation
with your you know 11 years plus
knowledge of the subject but a lifetime
of experience in being an intercultural
person
somebody's considering you know stepping
into this what would you say to them why
why should they even consider it
well it opens up a whole new world um
i'm actually coaching a gentleman at the
moment who's spanish uh living in spain
and he has been doing work lately since
lockdown with a lot of people in latin
america so yes they speak spanish but
boy do they have different cultures so
so now that the world is opening up and
okay here in the uae we do work with all
different nationalities or different
cultures on a regular basis it's nothing
new for us but even people who are you
know living in manchester and they've
never left manchester now that the world
has opened up to be dealing with people
from all over the world so easily just
literally clicking on a zoom call i
think it's
so important
to understand where the other person is
coming from in order to build stronger
relationships
and i'm actually shocked at how long it
has taken companies here in the middle
east to
get on board with intercultural
intelligence training you know that you
it's been going for many years but the
real interest has only happened in in
recent years so
now it's only going to
life is changing so rapidly that i think
it's it's important for those who care
about their employees
and care about the people that they're
working with whether they're coaching
and they've got clients to
truly understand
where people are coming from
because you can take as much artificial
intelligence as you can but people's
skills
are never going to go away well
certainly not in the near future you you
need to i think it's more important
to work in
parallel with artificial intelligence
than less important i actually think and
and some of the early signs are there
that artificial intelligence pushes us
human beings or requires from us to to
reach a new level yeah because the
mundane is going to be taken by
artificial intelligence machine learning
which means we will have to be an awful
lot better at
creativity
complex problem solving collaboration
negotiating with each other about your
idea versus my idea or a joint idea so
all these human skills will will have to
keep up so to speak with the machines
and that requires us to work together as
you said the world is opening up we're
working together with everybody
even remotely so doing all of that
in a culturally savvy way is i see it
happening all around me so yeah now we
we've just come through
first year of of a crisis that we've
never seen in a few generations
2021 q1 is almost over we're stepping
into the next uh part of the year
is there anything to be excited about
anything that you look forward to in
this year well i'm always excited about
things i have a natural
excitement for life but what's something
that just came to my mind is that now
we are all working remotely and dealing
with people in all over or different
parts of the world i'm actually
collaborating with somebody in toronto
that's nine hours behind
and new zealand that's nine hours ahead
and so my days are spreading and
the thought that just came to my mind
now you know the charity msf medicine
frontier which is you know doctors
without borders
well i think we have a world without
borders now um
yeah
you know i'm communicating with these
guys in toronto and guys in new zealand
there's no passport there's no visa
there's no travel there's no waiting in
immigration however much i love love
love travel but now we have life without
borders and let me tell you life without
borders we need to understand each other
absolutely i agree yeah working across
time zones has become so normal you know
the time zone calculators and where
daylight savings is kicking in and where
not is a continuous part of our calendar
screen so yeah and in terms of your
personal work where do you see the
opportunities and to to have an impact
in people's lives in this year
well i'm developing my own programs for
years i have been working with
corporates and you know creating the
perfect remedy to solve their challenges
i will continue to do that and behind
the scenes i'm creating my own programs
all for people to understand
their clients their their employees
better to be able to
be more productive and also
happier i think one thing that this last
year has shown a light on is that life's
too short
and you know we can be happy at work can
be doing work that plays to our
strengths so the more
we understand
our clients and our colleagues the
happier we can all be and the more
productive we can be
so yeah and also my individual programs
will then they're all to do with people
skills including intercultural
intelligence and they will be
obviously available to anybody on the
planet
wonderful yeah it definitely is a world
without borders
and uh we've enjoyed working with you
over all these years and seen
the places that you've had an impact in
people's lives and in teams and in
companies lives so it's beautiful to see
how that has been unfolding so thank you
for your willingness to share your story
today and uh i hope people will look you
up as well we will have karina's details
available as well on the podcast channel
and thank you guys for listening in
more stories to come from our
intercultural global network beautiful
people that are involved in fascinating
work all around the globe so look out
for for additional stories of people
in a global world
without borders according to corina and
a world where intercultural intelligence
is making a difference in people's lives
thank you for listening guys see you
next time fantastic bye-bye
thank you so much for joining us for
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if you would like to learn more about
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[Music]